Legislature(2013 - 2014)CAPITOL 106
02/18/2014 08:00 AM House STATE AFFAIRS
| Audio | Topic |
|---|---|
| Start | |
| HB199 | |
| HB212 | |
| HB273 | |
| Adjourn |
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
| += | HB 199 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| + | HB 212 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| *+ | HB 273 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| + | TELECONFERENCED |
HB 199-VPSO FIREARMS
8:04:27 AM
CHAIR LYNN announced the first order of business was HOUSE BILL
NO. 199, "An Act relating to Department of Public Safety
regulations allowing village public safety officers to carry
firearms."
8:05:26 AM
REPRESENTATIVE BRYCE EDGMON, Alaska State Legislature, as prime
sponsor, presented HB 199. He recollected that at the prior
hearing on HB 199, on 2/13/14, Representative Hughes had asked a
couple questions.
8:07:01 AM
REPRESENTATIVE HUGHES explained that her questions had been in
regard to the screening and training of VPSOs, and she said she
would like the Department of Public Safety (DPS) to address
them.
CHAIR LYNN indicated he would hear other testimony first.
8:08:07 AM
JOE MASTERS stated that although he had worked in law
enforcement for over 30 years - as a Village Public Safety
Officer (VPSO) in Unalakleet, a rural police officer, an Alaska
State Trooper, and five years as commissioner of DPS - he was
testifying on his own behalf. He said he would discuss the
unique nature of VPSOs and their duties and the issue of their
safety. He said VPSOs are an important and integral part of the
safety of rural villagers. He said many communities with VPSOs
have no other source of law enforcement. Occasionally there are
village police officers (VPOs), but often they are not armed
either. He said over the past few years there has been an
increase in assaults on police officers in Alaska. Since 2002,
the rate of injury assaults on Alaska police officers increased
by 66 percent, while the rate of non-injury assaults increased
by 137 percent. He said there have been seven incidents over
the past several years where VPSOs have been threatened by
subjects using fire arms. He said the aforementioned incident
that ended Mr. Madole's life was widely publicized, but just
prior to that there was a known incident in Southwest Alaska,
outside of Bethel, where a VPSO was chased by a subject with a
shotgun and received pellets to the face. He said there was
also a VPSO in a community outside of Kotzebue, who was backed
down the street by a subject, who was tackled by another
bystander and did not shoot at the VPSO. He said there are many
similar examples. He stated that VPSOs have been law
enforcement officer for over 30 years in rural Alaska.
8:12:10 AM
MR. MASTERS said the idea of a VPSO being armed is not a new
concept; in the early '80s, a VPSO could be armed if their
communities accepted additional liability insurance. He said he
does not recall what the training requirement was.
8:12:45 AM
CHAIR LYNN asked Mr. Masters if there have been past incidents
where armed VPSOs misused their weapons.
MR. MASTERS answered that he does not recall any incidents
during the time he served as a rural officer, but cannot say for
certain. Mr. Masters relayed that in the early '90s there was a
transition course, which helped VPSOs fill traditional police
positions. He said he was a trainer in Sitka at the time and
also instructed courses in the use of firearms. He said during
that time there were no more problems as a result of the
training or relating to decisions of when the use of deadly
force was acceptable compared to any other law enforcement
academies. He acknowledged that there are people concerned
about training and background [checks] for VPSOs, which are
issues he said need to be addressed. Notwithstanding that, he
opined that it is time to offer the necessary tools to VPSOs
that are trained properly so that they can defend themselves.
He said under current statute, VPSOs are allowed to carry a
firearm, but only under extreme exigent circumstances; however,
those circumstances can happen so quickly that a VPSO may not
have time to go get a firearm. Mr. Masters emphasized his
strong support of HB 199. He revealed that when he was
commissioner, he had begun a regulation process to allow VPSOs
to be armed and address the training aspect, as well, because he
was sure that DPS "held the responsibility and the authority to
dictate what level of training and certification was required
prior to a VPSO being allowed to be armed."
8:16:30 AM
CHAIR LYNN expressed appreciation for Mr. Masters' testimony
because of his varied related job positions. He asked how the
training back at the time VPSOs were armed in the past compares
to the training proposed under HB 199.
MR. MASTERS answered that the amount of training given in the
1980s to all types of law enforcement officers was much less
than it is today. He posited that it is more relevant what kind
of training will be given today, and he warned against putting
too much detail in VPSO training to the point that it would be
above and beyond that which a police officer does.
8:19:13 AM
JAKE METCALFE, Executive Director, Public Safety Employees
Association (PSEA) Local 803, said Local 803 serves state
troopers, airport police, court service officers, and municipal
police departments in Ketchikan, Sitka, Juneau, Fairbanks,
Soldotna, Unalaska, and Dillingham. He said VPSOs are not
members of Local 803; however, the state troopers oversee them
and work with them on a daily basis. He related that from 1990-
[1994], he worked as an assistant district attorney, and from
1994-1997 he was a district attorney in Bethel, where he worked
in the capacity of prosecutor with VPSOs employed by the
Association of Village Council Presidents. He said the people
who worked in his office worked with VPSOs on a regular basis.
He said he thinks not only does he know how important VPSOs are
to villages, but he also has an understanding of their job
duties. He said VPSOs are certified to be VPSOs, not police
officers; law enforcement is a limited portion of what they do,
and it is done on a limited basis. He said VPSOs do not go
through the same amount of training as state troopers or
municipal police officers go through, which he explained is one
of the concerns that PSEA Local 803 has with the proposed
legislation.
MR. METCALFE said police officers receive a great deal of
training before being authorized to work alone with a weapon,
and he offered his understanding that under HB 199 and the
attached fiscal note, that training has not been considered. He
said PSEA Local 803 thinks that the fiscal note is not accurate,
because there is training that should be required. He said a
police certificate requires 900 hours of training, while a VPSO
certificate, which does not require the basic law enforcement
training, requires approximately 600 hours. Further, when a
police officer finishes training, he/she goes out in the field
with an experienced police officer for up to six months. He
said if the same thing is anticipated under HB 199, then that
would require a state trooper to do the field training, which
would mean a considerable amount of increased funding.
8:23:18 AM
MR. METCALFE stated that Captain Steven Arlow has given a
presentation on the VPSO Program to a couple of legislative
committees, and one statistic given is that there is about a 30-
percent turnover in the VPSO Program on a yearly basis. He said
that by his calculations, there is a complete turnover about
every three years. He said he thinks that turnover is something
that should be considered as repetitive in terms of the cost to
the state. He urged the committee to get more information about
the training that would be required and the true cost under HB
199 in arming VPSOs.
8:24:41 AM
CHAIR LYNN pondered whether the stress of working in remote
locations without proper defense is a factor in the high
turnover of VPSOs.
MR. METCALFE ventured there are a number of factors that go into
the turnover rate, including: the lack of a retirement program;
insufficient pay, and working outside ones own community. He
said part of it could be the stress of being unarmed; however,
much of what a VPSO does is not related to law enforcement. For
example, VPSOs are involved in search and rescue, fire, and
educating students in schools. He said the law enforcement
aspect involves helping state troopers with misdemeanor cases;
very seldom are they involved in felony cases other than to help
a trooper who is going into a community to investigate a felony.
He reiterated that there are many factors that go into the
turnover of VPSOs.
8:26:53 AM
REPRESENTATIVE KELLER challenged Mr. Metcalfe's testimony that a
turnover rate of approximately 30 percent means that there is a
complete turnover about every three years, because "you may get
turnover rates up because of problems in one area that can be
dealt with."
8:27:33 AM
MR. METCALFE said he appreciates Representative Keller's
comment, because there are a number of ways to look at the
issue. He opined that 30 percent a year is an amount that needs
to be considered in the cost of training, because 30 percent in
any program is costly.
REPRESENTATIVE KELLER clarified that his comment had not been
pointed to the 30 percent a year turnover, but rather to Mr.
Metcalfe's conclusion that that means the whole program turns
over every three years.
MR. METCALFE said 30 percent is huge amount that should be
considered in the cost of the proposed legislation.
8:29:09 AM
MARK SPRINGER said although he serves on the Bethel City Council
and is on the Alaska Municipal League (AML) Board of Directors,
he is testifying on behalf of himself. He said he has lived in
rural Alaska since 1976, in Hooper Bay, as a city administrator
who hired VPSOs. He opined that Mr. Metcalfe's characterization
of the job of a VPSO - as focused primarily on fire fighting,
search and rescue, and visiting schools - was a
mischaracterization of the work done by VPSOs. He said dispatch
cards will show that VPSOs enforce state laws every day. They
involve themselves in driving under the influence (DUI) and
domestic violence cases, conducting preliminary investigations
of serious crimes, securing crime scenes until state troopers
arrive, and assisting troopers with felony investigations. He
related one reason that it is said VPSOs do not do felony work
is that often a district attorney will not take felony paperwork
from a VPSO, even though a VPSO "may be, by dint of experience,
perfectly qualified to perform the initial part of a felony
investigation."
MR. SPRINGER stated his full support of HB 199 and urged the
committee's support. He concurred with the testimony of former
VPSO and commissioner of DPS, Mr. Masters. He said both Mr.
Masters and Mr. Metcalfe made an important point that VPSOs in
Alaska are not peace officers under state statute. He stated he
has always thought that they ought to be. He said they used to
be certified by the Alaska Police Standards Council (APSC), but
that ended more than ten years ago. He opined that the APSC
should be the agency that sets the standards for training for
VPSOs to carry firearms. He said Alaskans can be proud of how
the Alaska State Troopers' "consistent, judicious, and measured
application of force, and particularly deadly force, as compared
to a lot of other law enforcement agencies in the United
States." He indicated his confidence in allowing the
commissioner to set and enforce the standards for VPSOs to be
armed and be trained to the same degree as the troopers. He
described a situation where a trooper responds to a call where
there may be an inebriated person with a shotgun and the door
gets kicked in, and he said that is the type of situation he
wants to see VPSOs handle. He said there are a lot of
experienced VPSOs in the state; many in his region have been
certified police officers. He said when a police officer
becomes a VPSO, "the clock stops" on his "law enforcement time"
for the APSC. Mr. Springer concluded his testimony by relating
that he has had his life protected by a VPSO, and by reiterating
his support of HB 199.
8:35:17 AM
REPRESENTATIVE ISAACSON expressed appreciation for Mr.
Springer's testimony. He indicated that during its prior
hearing on HB 199, the committee learned that the requirements
for the minimum standards and training would be directed by the
APSC. He asked Mr. Springer to confirm that he supports that
portion of the proposed legislation.
MR. SPRINGER answered yes.
8:36:50 AM
REPRESENTATIVE HUGHES asked the next testifier, Captain Steven
Arlow, to address the issues of training, screening, and the
ability of Native corporations that hire VPSOs to conduct "extra
background screening or anything like that."
8:37:57 AM
STEVEN ARLOW, Captain, Alaska State Troopers, VPSO Support,
Department of Public Safety (DPS), said he has overseen the VPSO
Program for DPS for the last eight years and is familiar with
the issues that the program faces. He said he listened to the
previous testifiers and would like to outline the department's
current plan and address statements that were made. He relayed
there are ten contracting entities in the VPSO Program that will
be involved in all aspects of the department's decision-making
process. He said the department wants to hold VPSOs to the same
firearms training standard as that of Alaska State Troopers. He
said there has been discussion among the various nonprofit
groups and contractors regarding the possibility of doing a
polygraph test and psychological evaluation. He indicated a
cost of $400 related to evaluation. He said that is something
the department would entertain doing.
MR. ARLOW, regarding the question about turnover, said the
percentage is about 33 percent; however, he said it is not
accurate to say that the entire program is at 33 percent,
because it is more of a region-specific turnover. There are
some stable regions that have very little turnover. He said the
VPSO Program was designed to conduct search and rescue and fire
safety efforts and take part in school resource activities, as
well as take part in law enforcement; it was not intended to be
predominately law enforcement focused, but has morphed into that
because of the large volume of service calls in some areas. He
said that is where there is a high turnover rate. He said he
does not disagree that a high turnover rate is expensive for the
department; however, he said that percentage has been in the
program for several decades. He said the department has studied
the turnover and believes the cause is not pay or retirement,
because each nonprofit provides a 401-K base - one of them in
the Public Employee Retirement System (PERS) - and the current
pay for VPSOs is "fair and reasonable" and matches that of many
law enforcement entities in the state. He related that there
are some VPSOs who make $70,000 to $80,000 a year and a few,
with longevity, who are making six figures. He said he thinks
the attrition is due to burnout and a region in the state that
is experiencing a high volume of law enforcement work. He said
half of the turnover rate is a result of VPSOs making poor
choices on and off the job; they are being dismissed for failure
to perform their duties.
8:43:56 AM
CAPTAIN ARLOW stated that he does not disagree with Mr.
Metcalfe's characterization of the fiscal note as inaccurate,
but suggested Mr. Metcalfe might not understand the fiscal note
is a representation of what the department would like to do if
HB 199 passes. He explained that DPS is interested in starting
a pilot program where a few VPSOs in a particular region would
be put through a gamut of training and evaluation, introducing
the VPSOs into a community, and measuring the community
reaction. He said DPS anticipates that such a pilot program
would entail "less of a funding need right now." He said once
the department can verify that the program is well-received by a
community and that the VPSOs are using the firearms in the
manner in which they are trained, then it will feel more
comfortable in opening up the program.
8:45:21 AM
CAPTAIN ARLOW said firearm training is as much about when not to
use one as when to use one. During field training, a "seasoned
person" would be paired with a training VPSO to determine the
judgment of the VPSO. In regard to VPSOs not being members of
DPS, but rather being affiliated with non-profit entities, he
said continuity is paramount. He said the department's
insurance policy can be amended with language that would "help
in the relationship."
8:47:56 AM
REPRESENTATIVE ISAACSON asked if, under the pilot program, VPSO
time would count toward recertification of a municipal or police
officer whose certification had lapsed.
8:48:37 AM
CAPTAIN ARLOW responded that he would like to see that happen,
but said there will be "a considerable amount of structuring of
the Alaska Police Standards Council to get there."
8:49:35 AM
REPRESENTATIVE HUGHES thanked Captain Arlow for addressing her
concerns regarding training. She recalled testimony indicating
a high turnover of VPSOs in regions of the state where the large
portion of the duties of the VPSOs is in law enforcement, and
she asked Captain Arlow if he thinks the training program and
subsequent arming of those VPSOs would likely lower the turnover
rate.
CAPTAIN ARLOW said 30 percent is a high turnover rate. He
expressed his hope that training VPSOs to be equipped with
firearms would lower that rate, but he said time will tell. In
response to a follow-up question, he said he thinks that someone
in a uniform carrying a firearm increases people's perception of
authority. He related that right now the mere presence of a
VPSO makes people willing to report crime and over a period of
time, "we see that crime stabilizes and we have less reports of
paused service." He stated, "I think introduction to the
fire[arms] would certainly ... mirror that, as well."
8:52:42 AM
CHAIR LYNN opined that someone in uniform carrying a firearm
gives more perception of authority than does an unarmed officer.
8:53:05 AM
REPRESENTATIVE EDGMON expressed appreciation of all comments,
including those critical of bill. He talked about the
longstanding cooperative relationship between VPSOs, the
nonprofit agencies that hire them, and DPS. He said VPSO
coordinators meet quarterly and, in addition to that, meet with
the department. He said there have been numerous attempts over
the years to focus on the strengths and weaknesses of the VPSO
Program, most recently, in 2008, there was a Senate task force
addressing the VPSO Program, the result of which was the
commitment by former Commissioner Masters to increase the number
of VPSOs around the state. He offered his personal impression
that allowing VPSOs to carry arms will act as a deterrent [to
crime], decrease the number of VPSOs dropping out, and give
VPSOs the means to be law enforcement officers, which he said is
their charge. He thanked the committee for its work on the
proposed legislation.
8:55:18 AM
CHAIR LYNN, after ascertaining that there was no one else who
wished to testify, closed public testimony on HB 199.
8:55:29 AM
REPRESENTATIVE KELLER moved to report HB 199 out of committee
with individual recommendations and the accompanying fiscal
notes. There being no objection, HB 199 was reported out of the
House State Affairs Standing Committee.
| Document Name | Date/Time | Subjects |
|---|---|---|
| 01 HB 212 v.N.pdf |
HSTA 2/18/2014 8:00:00 AM |
HB 212 |
| 02 HB 212 Sponsor Statement.pdf |
HSTA 2/18/2014 8:00:00 AM |
HB 212 |
| 03 HB 212 Sectional.pdf |
HSTA 2/18/2014 8:00:00 AM |
HB 212 |
| 04 HB 212 Fiscal Note.pdf |
HSTA 2/18/2014 8:00:00 AM |
HB 212 |
| 05 HB212 Supporting Docs.pdf |
HSTA 2/18/2014 8:00:00 AM |
HB 212 |
| 06 HB 212 Supporting Letter.pdf |
HSTA 2/18/2014 8:00:00 AM |
HB 212 |
| 07 HB 212 Supporting Letter2.pdf |
HSTA 2/18/2014 8:00:00 AM |
HB 212 |
| 08 HB 212 Supporting Letter3.pdf |
HSTA 2/18/2014 8:00:00 AM |
HB 212 |
| 09 HB 212 Supporting Letter4.pdf |
HSTA 2/18/2014 8:00:00 AM |
HB 212 |
| 10 HB 212 Supporting Letter5.pdf |
HSTA 2/18/2014 8:00:00 AM |
HB 212 |
| 01 HB 273.pdf |
HSTA 2/18/2014 8:00:00 AM |
HB 273 |
| 02 HB 273 Sponsor Statement.pdf |
HSTA 2/18/2014 8:00:00 AM |
HB 273 |
| 03 HB273 Leg Audit for CDVSA.pdf |
HSTA 2/18/2014 8:00:00 AM |
HB 273 |
| 04 CDVSA Letter of Support HB273.pdf |
HSTA 2/18/2014 8:00:00 AM |
HB 273 |
| 05 fiscalNote DPS HB273.pdf |
HSTA 2/18/2014 8:00:00 AM |
HB 273 |